"Yes.  And I'm sorry if I'm being strident.  But the notion that we screened off our past to hide a shameful massacre in which the present system was established is just - as wildly strange as mistakes I've no doubt been making to you.  I know in detail why that can't be true and it is triggering all of the emotions that human beings have about shameful things being attributed to them that they did not do.  For one thing, there are people in a very causally sealed environment who get ongoing info about Civilization and who could break the seal on the past if there was reason to do that.  We know who gets sent in, we know approximately what values they have when they go in, we know the oats they took, we know they're still alive, and if there was nothing in there but a shameful massacre they'd just tell us that!  For another, we did get told that the framework that made the decision was pretty similar to our current framework especially in all the facets that aren't informative about the detailed past because they're just generically optimal solutions, and our current framework would not hide a shameful massacre, I don't know if I can convey to you how alien a thought that is.  We have a list of all the considerations that screening the past is more important than, so people know there wasn't just an obvious missed consideration motivating the decision as a mistake, and the number two item on that list is that we're losing all the knowledge of our past errors.  The present voters wouldn't go along with doing that on purpose, we know the past voters weren't so different because they did preserve convergent info about that particular decision and their value tradeoff list looks a lot like ours.  We know that the entire upper government agreed to be fired and permanently banned from politics just to reduce doubt that anyone involved had an incentive to support that decision for the wrong reasons.  I could go on!  It was a big decision!  We took all the obvious precautions and passed down knowledge of their convergent properties the same way we kept and sanitized knowledge of how to make steel and so on!"

"Yes.  And I'm sorry if I'm being strident.  But the notion that we screened off our past to hide a shameful massacre in which the present system was established is just - as wildly strange as mistakes I've no doubt been making to you.  I know in detail why that can't be true and it is triggering all of the emotions that human beings have about shameful things being attributed to them that they did not do.  For one thing, there are people in a very causally sealed environment who get ongoing info about Civilization and who could break the seal on the past if there was reason to do that.  We know who gets sent in, we know approximately what values they have when they go in, we know the oaths they took, we know they're still alive, and if there was nothing in there but a shameful massacre they'd just tell us that!  For another, we did get told that the framework that made the decision was pretty similar to our current framework especially in all the facets that aren't informative about the detailed past because they're just generically optimal solutions, and our current framework would not hide a shameful massacre, I don't know if I can convey to you how alien a thought that is.  We have a list of all the considerations that screening the past is more important than, so people know there wasn't just an obvious missed consideration motivating the decision as a mistake, and the number two item on that list is that we're losing all the knowledge of our past errors.  The present voters wouldn't go along with doing that on purpose, we know the past voters weren't so different because they did preserve convergent info about that particular decision and their value tradeoff list looks a lot like ours.  We know that the entire upper government agreed to be fired and permanently banned from politics just to reduce doubt that anyone involved had an incentive to support that decision for the wrong reasons.  I could go on!  It was a big decision!  We took all the obvious precautions and passed down knowledge of their convergent properties the same way we kept and sanitized knowledge of how to make steel and so on!"

"Yes.  And I'm sorry if I'm being strident.  But the notion that we screened off our past to hide a shameful massacre in which the present system was established is just - as wildly strange as mistakes I've no doubt been making to you.  I know in detail why that can't be true and it is triggering all of the emotions that human beings have about shameful things being attributed to them that they did not do.  For one thing, there are people in a very causally sealed environment who get ongoing info about Civilization and who could break the seal on the past if there was reason to do that.  We know who gets sent in, we know approximately what values they have when they go in, we know the oaths they took, we know they're still alive, and if there was nothing in there but a shameful massacre they'd just tell us that!  For another, we did get told that the framework that made the decision was pretty similar to our current framework, especially in all the facets that aren't informative about the detailed past because they're just generically optimal solutions, and our current framework would not hide a shameful massacre.  I don't know if I can convey to you how alien a thought that is.  We have a list of all the considerations that screening the past is more important than, so people know there wasn't just an obvious missed consideration motivating the decision as a mistake, and the number two item on that list is that we're losing all the knowledge of our past errors.  The present voters wouldn't go along with doing that on purpose, we know the past voters weren't so different because they did preserve convergent info about that particular decision and their value tradeoff list looks a lot like ours.  We know that the entire upper government agreed to be fired and permanently banned from politics just to reduce doubt that anyone involved had an incentive to support that decision for the wrong reasons.  I could go on!  It was a big decision!  We took all the obvious precautions and passed down knowledge of their convergent properties the same way we kept and sanitized knowledge of how to make steel and so on!"

"Yes.  And I'm sorry if I'm being strident.  But the notion that we screened off our past to hide a shameful massacre in which the present system was established is just - as wildly strange as mistakes I've no doubt been making to you.  I know in detail why that can't be true and it is triggering all of the emotions that human beings have about shameful things being attributed to them that they did not do.  For one thing, there are people in a very causally sealed environment who get ongoing info about Civilization and who could break the seal on the past if there was reason to do that.  We know who gets sent in, we know approximately what values they have when they go in, we do know the oaths they took, we know they're still alive, and if there was nothing in there but a shameful massacre they'd just tell us that!  For another, we did get told that the framework that made the decision was pretty similar to our current framework, especially in all the facets that aren't informative about the detailed past because they're just generically optimal solutions, and our current framework would not hide a shameful massacre.  I don't know if I can convey to you how alien a thought that is.  We have a list of all the considerations that screening the past is more important than, so people know there wasn't just an obvious missed consideration motivating the decision as a mistake, and the number two item on that list is that we're losing all the knowledge of our past errors.  The present voters wouldn't go along with doing that on purpose, we know the past voters weren't so different because they did preserve convergent info about that particular decision and their value tradeoff list looks a lot like ours.  We know that the entire upper government agreed to be fired and permanently banned from politics just to reduce doubt that anyone involved had an incentive to support that decision for the wrong reasons.  I could go on!  It was a big decision!  We took all the obvious precautions and passed down knowledge of their convergent properties the same way we kept and sanitized knowledge of how to make steel and so on!"

"Yes.  And I'm sorry if I'm being strident.  But the notion that we screened off our past to hide a shameful massacre in which the present system was established is just - as wildly strange as mistakes I've no doubt been making to you.  I know in detail why that can't be true and it is triggering all of the emotions that human beings have about shameful things being attributed to them that they did not do.  For one thing, there are people in a very causally sealed environment who get ongoing info about Civilization and who could break the seal on the past if there was reason to do that.  We know who gets sent in, we know approximately what values they have when they go in, we know the oaths they took, we do know they're still alive, and if there was nothing in there but a shameful massacre they'd just tell us that!  For another, we did get told that the framework that made the decision was pretty similar to our current framework, especially in all the facets that aren't informative about the detailed past because they're just generically optimal solutions, and our current framework would not hide a shameful massacre.  I don't know if I can convey to you how alien a thought that is.  We have a list of all the considerations that screening the past is more important than, so people know there wasn't just an obvious missed consideration motivating the decision as a mistake, and the number two item on that list is that we're losing all the knowledge of our past errors.  The present voters wouldn't go along with doing that on purpose, we know the past voters weren't so different because they did preserve convergent info about that particular decision and their value tradeoff list looks a lot like ours.  We know that the entire upper government agreed to be fired and permanently banned from politics just to reduce doubt that anyone involved had an incentive to support that decision for the wrong reasons.  I could go on!  It was a big decision!  We took all the obvious precautions and passed down knowledge of their convergent properties the same way we kept and sanitized knowledge of how to make steel and so on!"